Dynamic code anyone?

Jan 10, 2008 at 12:37 PM
Did you guys know about this engine? Lucia engine? It comes with the source code, but it give some erros when I try to compile. We can see some videos of this engine working.
Just look at this one: Dynamic code

You can find the engine here: Lucia engine
Jan 10, 2008 at 1:02 PM
Looks good, nice to see others are taking Xna on as well :) (Nice to see other danish devs getting their feet wet on Xna)
Jan 10, 2008 at 3:12 PM
Cool. Dynamic compilation is pretty easy to get working in .NET, but you have to keep in mind that it doesn't work on Xbox.
Jan 10, 2008 at 3:19 PM
Edited Jan 10, 2008 at 3:20 PM


shawmishrak wrote:
Cool. Dynamic compilation is pretty easy to get working in .NET, but you have to keep in mind that it doesn't work on Xbox.


Yes, but would be something that would only work inside the scene editor. After publish a game with the editor, all the scripts should be compiled also.

The engine site has more videos. The guy has a nice engine. And the best is that we can see the source. ;)
Jan 10, 2008 at 3:31 PM
How do you envision doing the publishing? There is no reason to have scripting if complilation is required.

Also do not use others source in shared projects. In this project there is no copyright owner set so there shouldn't be any legal restrictions (I'm not a layer so I might be wrong), but many require you to have a copy notice or keep the source header intact.
Jan 10, 2008 at 3:49 PM
Edited Jan 10, 2008 at 3:50 PM


Sturm wrote:
How do you envision doing the publishing? There is no reason to have scripting if complilation is required.

Also do not use others source in shared projects. In this project there is no copyright owner set so there shouldn't be any legal restrictions (I'm not a layer so I might be wrong), but many require you to have a copy notice or keep the source header intact.


"And the best is that we can see the source. ;)"
I meant that we can learn from it! The same way people look at this engine code and learn from it too. That is the purpose of opensource projects, isn't?

The scripting will come in need if we finish a engine version and release it to work without visual studio.
Publishing will come the same way I plan to add the import models features without visual studio, by using msbuild.
Jan 10, 2008 at 3:58 PM


Publishing will come the same way I plan to add the import models features without visual studio, by using msbuild.



There's a fundamental flaw in that statement. You cannot use the XNA Content Pipeline without Visual Studio, as decreed by the XNA team. :)

More specifically, the XNA Content Pipeline requires XNA Game Studio to be installed, which requires a copy of Visual Studio to be installed. It's lame. Myself and others have pleaded many times to make the content pipeline assemblies a part of the redist, but they don't want to do that.

Jan 10, 2008 at 3:59 PM
I might be wrong but msbuild is part of VS so not accessible unless you have VS installed?
Jan 10, 2008 at 5:18 PM
Edited Jan 10, 2008 at 5:28 PM
"There's a fundamental flaw in that statement. You cannot use the XNA Content Pipeline without Visual Studio, as decreed by the XNA team. :)"

Yes I can! This is just just like have windows forms with XNA.

And msbuild is part of .Net framework.

Give a look at this: XNA Content Builder.

XNA Content Builder developer:
You only need to have .Net Framework 2.0 installed. All other XNA .dlls can be copied from the the Redist directory (where XNA Studio Express is installed) to the directoy of your executable. As I counted it will be 3 XNA dlls and 4 directx dlls (if you extract the cab files).
I do this for all of my XNA programs so the user don't need to install anything else.
Jan 10, 2008 at 6:24 PM
Edited Jan 10, 2008 at 6:25 PM
Technically, yes. Legally, no.

You are not allowed to copy XNA or DirectX DLLs. You can only distribute the redist packages, but the XNA redist does not contain the content pipeline assembly. Hence, how are users supposed to get them?

I used XNA Content Builder a lot in the 1.0 days because I didn't want to use Visual C# Express. But the fact remains that you cannot legally use that tool (and the XNA content pipeline) without installing the full XNA Game Studio package, which requires VS, either pro or express.

As far as I know, MSBuild comes with the .NET runtime. You don't even need the .NET SDK.
Jan 10, 2008 at 6:46 PM
Edited Jan 10, 2008 at 6:48 PM
And before anyone asks:

  • We will not do anything which knowingly goes against any EULA or License. If you are using any commercial/non-commercial product to create any asset for this project, be it code or artwork or otherwise, for which you do not have the proper rights, you are to remove all those assets immediately. You are personally responsible for releasing any asset here and by releasing you guarantee that you have the right to the asset, the tools used to create the asset and are not under any NDA or similar disclosure which would prevent you from, legally, releasing the asset.
Jan 10, 2008 at 7:19 PM


shawmishrak wrote:
Technically, yes. Legally, no.

You are not allowed to copy XNA or DirectX DLLs. You can only distribute the redist packages, but the XNA redist does not contain the content pipeline assembly. Hence, how are users supposed to get them?



shawmishrak, can you point me where you read this legal issue with the dlls? I search every and I didn't find!
Thanks.

Jan 10, 2008 at 7:33 PM
The EULA is your 'friend'

Right to Use and Distribute. The code files listed below are “Distributable Code.”
  • You may copy and distribute the file XNAFX20_REDIST.MSI and permit distributors of your programs to copy and distribute the Distributable Code as part of those Windows platform programs.

Jan 10, 2008 at 7:46 PM
Edited Jan 10, 2008 at 7:50 PM


Sturm wrote:
The EULA is your 'friend'

Right to Use and Distribute. The code files listed below are “Distributable Code.”
  • You may copy and distribute the file XNAFX20_REDIST.MSI and permit distributors of your programs to copy and distribute the Distributable Code as part of those Windows platform programs.



That doens't prevent us from distributing any dlls legally. Unless it says something like this: "You may copy and distribute ONLY" the file..."

or something like this: "You may not copy or distribute any dlls..."

Anyway, even the guys at XNA creators clubs point us the link to XNA content builder or some article on how to use msbuild. But they also said to add a request for releasing the content pipeline dlls with the redistributable package on the connect site.
Jan 10, 2008 at 7:48 PM
As a general rule of thumb, Microsoft DLLs are not distributable. You can only distribute the redistributable packages.
Jan 10, 2008 at 7:59 PM
Also this was written within the read me file of the XNA beta:

_"What is not in this Beta (but coming soon)

While we’re very proud of this Beta milestone, it does not represent all of the great features we are enabling in XNA Game Studio Express which will be available in final release form by this holiday. Some of the key feature areas that were not able to make it into this beta include:

The XNA Framework Content Pipeline feature is not present in this release of XNA Game Studio Express (Beta). It will be made available in a future beta release of XNA Game Studio Express
Support for retail Xbox 360 game development. This feature will be made available upon final release of XNA Game Studio Express later this holiday
Additional starter kits and tutorials will be made available upon final release of XNA Game Studio Express" _

So, it is just a matter of time. I will be implementing into the engine, but not releasing until it becomes avaliable!
Jan 10, 2008 at 7:59 PM

xnasorcerer wrote:
That doens't prevent us from distributing any dlls legally. Unless it says something like this: "You may copy and distribute ONLY" the file..."

or something like this: "You may not copy or distribute any dlls..."


It does exactly that, the only file you are allowed to distribute is the XNAFX20_REDIST.MSI file, as Shaw points out this is general microsoft policy.


xnasorcerer wrote:
Anyway, even the guys at XNA creators clubs point us the link to XNA content builder or some article on how to use msbuild. But they also said to add a request for releasing the content pipeline dlls with the redistributable package on the connect site.


And you should go do it. The content pipeline will likely end up in the redist or in a new installer as not every xna user will need them. But that's up to MS (Xna team) to decide.
Jan 10, 2008 at 8:05 PM
I already did it. So please, go overther and add your vote also! Content pipeline dlls into redistributable package
Jan 11, 2008 at 5:54 AM
I guess the XNA guys are wanting to help me out. Look! WinForms Series 2: Content Loading

A sample showing how to load and compile a model in runtime, also with winforms. But they made a lot of code just to add a form into xna. I just use only a few lines.
Coordinator
Jan 11, 2008 at 6:29 AM
lol, that is freaking awesome. I remember asking Shawn to have the team make WinForms samples once they mentioned it wouldn't be fully supported in XNA 2.0.

Wish granted.

2.0 might be missing a lot, but at least they're trying.
Jan 11, 2008 at 3:46 PM
Nice, you found those quicK! Cheers for the heads up.